Tommyp

From the image shown on eBay I cannot rule out that the extra holes are factory. The seller attempted to send me extra images but they did not make it through the email. So I don't know. what do you see that convinces you that this is modification by a previous owner? Have you seen extra images? Thanks your input is always appreciated!

Hey Dave!

You know, so much of this gets into a "gray area" as there is no real way to absolutely know who did what to this drum! But, this I do know:

It is EASY to add tone controls/mufflers to ANY manufacturers drum with a little patience, some precision, and a drill. I just don't think that Rogers would set up their TOP OF THE LINE snare drum with a tone control dampening the bottom/resonant head... that goes against everything the Dynasonic was designed for! In all my years of playing/studying Rogers drums... ( and there are a lot of years! ) ... I haven't ever seen this configuration before, and probably won't ever again... because it's just stupid. However... who knows if it was requested when the drum was ordered, or added later... ( which is what I think is the case here! ) ... it doesn't change the fact that it is just dumb. And...

There is no freaking way that BR would own/play this drum in this set-up with not one, but two, tone controls! I have a TON of BR media, all types, dating back to the late 40's, up and through his Rogers endorsement, and have never seen ONE tone control on his Rogers Dynasonic snare drums let alone two. The value of this drum is ruined in my opinion, soley BECAUSE of the EXTRA tone control.

Tommyp

Lighten up, Tommy. Since Rogers' philosophy, particularly in the 60s, was to adapt to drummer's needs, anything was possible. I have had kits that clearly exhibit something other than you find in their catalog. Rogers was all about research and experimentation in the late 50s and early 60s. Sure, the snare head tone control makes no sense, sort of like your "dill weed" statement.

Ruffled your feathers a tad did I Ken? Let's address that first, then we can talk about Rogers! And while I'm at it... WELCOME BACK to Rogers after a 20 year hiatus! As for me, let's see... I make my living playing professionally... ( 38 years now! ) ... and also through the vintage drum... buy/sell/restore scene... with Rogers being my area of knowledge. Reason for that I guess would be 40 years of owning/playing Rogers drums! So...

The term "dillweed" was meant entirely in a sarcastic/comedic vein. I am still boggled as to WHY someone would ADD a tone control to the resonant head of a SNARE DRUM... especially a Rogers Dynasonic. This wasn't meant to insult/offend... but you obviously were. Makes me wonder... you aren't the "dillweed" that did it are you? HA!!!!!! Just jokin' here again Ken... so please don't get your shorts all rufflled! After all, you are in agreement with the addition of the tone control for the bottom/resonant head being ridiculous... and that is coupled with the fact that the ORIGINAL inquiry of this thread was "could this have been Buddy's snare drum"... and again I maintain that no, it wasn't. Well, at least in the configuration it is in now anyway. And for the record: If I was the one that drilled this drum for a second tone control/muffler for the bottom/resonant head, I would call myself a "dillweed"! Nuff said there.

Regarding Rogers and their "philosophy" towards experimentation/building drums: YES!!! Ken, I agree... to a point. I would like to see these drums that you have owned that came out of the factory "exibiting something other than you find in the Rogers catalog", with the obvious exception being additional mounts/accessories which in no way compromise the tonal integrity/intention of the drum... unlike the second tone control on the Dynasonic in question. Without launching into a giant dissertation on the reasons for HOW the Dynasonic came to be with regard to it's invention/development, I can only imagine Joe Thompson rolling his eyes if and when the order actually came in to mount an additional tone control on the BOTTOM/RESONANT snare head of his baby, the Dynasonic snare drum. Would Rogers service that request? Sure they would! They were after all in the business of selling drums. But there would have been a lot of head shaking/eye rolling I'm sure. Remember,

The whole reason behind the Rogers Dynasonic snare drum in the first place was to create a drum that wouldn't choke... under any circumstances. A tone control on the bottom/resonant snare head... nope, don't think so. I still think it was added after the fact because of the very reasons I mentioned prior: The owner/player didn't understand how to set the drum up correctly... and if a Rogers Dynasonic isn't set up correctly, it can be a virtual "buzz-bomb". So...

Was the person responsible for the addition of the tone control a "dillweed"?... NO ... and again it was meant in a humerous vein. But it sure was dumb. Oh, by the way,

I have/play four Dynasonics, two of which are wood/WMP. My 1967 WMP Dynasonic has NO TONE CONTROL... could it be Buddy's???!!! :-)

Tommyp

I guess this is all academic now the seller pulled the Buddy Rich Dyna-Sonic with 2 factory tone muffler hole sets. I have to say though that having dealt with exceptional customers on high end products, which lend themselves to customizing at the factory and dealership levels _ (for most of 30 years now) _ it would be my opinion that a factory installed second muffler is more than possible and even likely. If this particular eBay seller had sent the images I asked for and if the holes looked as factory as they could in a digital image, I would have sent my son to inspect. Holes that would pass scrutiny for possible factory holes? are difficult for the average person! If my son thought it was possible these holes were factory I would have attempted to buy this Dyna snare drum. That is why I was very interested to know why some think this is not factory installation. The only images I can see don?t provide me with an opinion one way or the other and I have experience looking for such proof.

Though I don?t think I of know anyone who uses a single adjustable muffler? maybe I do? much less know anyone who would want two of them? I would like to own such a unique Dyna snare drum, if it is believed to be original or a modification by an authorized Rogers service center of the day. Either of these possibilities I would find appealing. Factory installed, "very appealing". Dealer installed, while not quite ?very appealing?, still appealing to me if they used a template and drill press for precision.

This Dyna would always have a story. Resale will never be as simple as a clean standard issue example or a clean example without any tone muffler? because who knows who owned or previously played the Dyna without the tone muffler installed from the factory.

With most high end collectables there are no absolutes except maybe that there will absolutely be exceptions to the catalog listings. Smart collectors look for the items that they are passion about in historical photographs that inadvertently show the items in use.

This drum may have been owned by a local hometown hero that just wanted to try two mufflers. One up and one down! But we may never see this drum again? so I don?t know. I have written the seller to see what happened and if I can get this drum, with one up and one down, I will have my two sons do an analysis of it, both audio and video. I think it would be at least interesting and I think it may very well prove some here correct.

If anyone hears of another "one up and one down" Dyna I am interested!

Thanks

Dave

Hey unless you absolutely know it wasn?t owned or played by BR at some time there is a % chance that it is BRs.

For example any ?50s Gibson Explorer ?ink stamped serial number? you see has at least a 13% chance of being owned by Eric Clapton. If you can see that the neck was broken and then repaired or if the body was cut aftermarket the % goes up.Yes Sir

Thanks

Dave

Hey Dave!

You know, you are an excellent guy!... and I base that on all of our conversations!... but ... this thing with the TWO tone controls on the Dynasonic is just NUTS! I don't know why you are so attracted to it. Regardless, if you totally understand how the Dynasonic snare drum was conceived/designed, you will then know that a tone control/muffler on the bottom resonant head is just plain ridiculous.

The whole idea of this snare drum is sensitivity/response/no choking, all at any volume level, and the drum delivers. Now... for the sake of argument, DAMPEN the bottom resonant head with the tone control/muffler... what do you have? A muffled/choked/very DRY sounding Dynasonic. What's the point of doing this? If that's the sound one is looking for... don't buy a Dynasonic. It's really that simple. I would say have a re-read of response #14. What I wrote about Joe Thompson probably really happened if this was factory installed. He had to have rolled his eyes! The second tone control/muffler goes against everything that was designed into the Dynasonic. I just don't get it.

I don't think you will find another one either. I honestly think this was done to try and "control" the sound of the drum by the original owner who obviously had no clue as to what he was doing regarding the set-up of a Dynasonic. Too bad too... it is WMP... it is a 1966... desirable qualities!

I was just kidding on my '67 WMP Dynasonic Dave... I know that it isn't/wasn't Buddy's! I have the history on this drum... cool thing is, I am only the 2nd owner! Always a pleasure Dave!

Tommyp

Not wanting to interfere with this topic and I'm not a Rogers collector etc..

But from a builders standpoint if the drum already had a tone control it, it would not take a skilled craftsman much effort to make the second set of holes.

Since he could base the entire project on measurements he already has.

Currently a lot of guys are building drums better then current manufacturers with better craftmanship.

So if the guy had some talent he could easily duplicate the second set of holes. And over the years if both tone controls were installed they would both take on the same charecteristics.

That is all for me, I can't add any more to the topic other then that little perspective.

On another note however, in regards to Dill Weed have you ever used it in cooking? Laughing HGroup Hug

David

Webmaster

Nah... I prefer Basil!!!

Tommyp

This is why some bass drums are filled with packing peanuts or blankets.

You cant dampen the resonant on a Dynasonic with out turning it into crap.